Caring for Wild Caught Fish...

[fischfan13]

This thread is for anyone at anytime taking in Wild Caught fish.
This thread is to share and help.
This thread is to GIVE ADVICE on what has worked for you or the advice that has been given to you that has worked or not worked when taking in Wild Caught fish.

Share everything. Share the successes and share the deaths...we will ALL learn from this.

Some of us have taken in Wild Caught's for years, some have never taken in a Wild Caught fish and some have taken in a few.

Learn.
Teach.
That's what this thread is for.

Some of the questions and topics that should be touched are...
To Medicate or not.
Water changes...how often.
Salt?
Metro?
How long can parasites linger in a fish when not treated?
Deworming.
Other meds.
Quarantine times.

[emartin]

Wild caught fish that I have owned that were either freshly imported or freshly collected have usually faired really well for me.

Some of the things that are extremely beneficial for the health of the wild caught fish is exceptionally clean water quality, large amounts of oxygen saturation (the more surface agitation the better), proper water chemistry (replicate, if possible, the water chemistry the fish species experiences in the wild (in freshwater aquaria, that's pH and water hardness/softness, etc)), and a dimly lit tank with lots of hiding places (pvc pipes, clay pipes/flowerpots, etc).

Also, keep the aquarium lid as firmly closed as possible. You don't want your wild fish getting spooked or stressed and have them jumping out of your tank onto the floor. If you can't keep the lid closed firmly, then keep the water level low.

Freshly wild caught fish do not like aquarium conditions at first, the bright lights and small quarters will stress them. Keeping them in dim lit aquariums reduces that stress, allows the fish to hide better (fish think that if they can't see you/other fish, they can't see them. You may notice this when you see fish try to hide with their front-half in a crevice while their back-half is sticking out in the open).

Do not try to feed pellets. I've only had a very small amount of wild caught fish accept pellets. The others I've had would either only eat frozen food or maybe some flake food. The reason I say not to feed pellets is chances are your fish will not swallow them, end up spitting them out, and then the uneaten food will pollute the aquarium. Whatever you do feed, whether it be flake, frozen food, etc, feed in moderation and only after the fish are fully accustomed to aquarium living (appear to no longer be stressed). Usually this is after about 3-7 full days I have deemed wild fish able to accept food.

Now....when you're fish get sick or injured...treat them right away after you have correctly identified the symptoms and use the appropriate medication. I would not use super-strong medications like Clout.

Good anti-parasite medications include:
Metronidasole (get the pure stuff, kensfish.com and jehmco.com, and it does not harm the biofilter)
Jungle Parasite-Clear (good broad-spectrum anti-parasite med, does not harm the biofilter. It's cheaper to buy in bulk from Jehmco or Kensfish because it is only available in tablets)
Praziquantel (not sure about this one, if it's bio-filter friendly that is)

Good anti-bacterial and anti-fungal meds (these do harm the biofilter, so unless all of your fish are suffering I would separate the affected fish from the group and treat it in a hospital tank):
Oxytetracycline hydrochloride
Jungle Binox
Furan-2
Triple Sulfa
Nitrofurazone


Now...a great anti-fungal and anti-external parasite medication is Sea Salt. This is great for ich treatment. It also helps stimulate the fish's slime coat (which helps protect them from parasites), and helps kill fungus. This would be good to add in small amounts (I usually hear people say 2tbsp/10gal) to your tanks that will be holding rift lake cichlids as it helps raise the water hardness, let alone its other benefits. You can buy this as "Aquarium Salt", Kosher Salt, or as "Solar Salt" at hardware stores. The cheapest place to buy it is Home Depot or Lowes where it is sold as Solar Salt in 40lb bags for about $4. The bag should be blue, and the salt content should be about 99.6% sea salt (the 0.4% impurities is just sand or gravel, since the salt is from evaporated sea water in the Caribbean).



Also, for those of you who are not familiar with keeping wild caught fish, a lot of wild caught rift lake fish have what is dubbed "black spot disease". This is a harmless parasite that from what I hear will not respond to treatment but does go away over time on its own. Don't worry about it, it's harmless. I actually have some fish with it now, one of which just spawned recently. It's completely harmless.



So here are some of the tips above in summary:

Keep the tank dark; just use a flash light or the room light to see your fish for the first couple days/weeks. Make sure there are hiding places for the fish, and that the tank lid is firmly closed with as little openings as possible for gas exchange
Make sure there is plenty of oxygen saturation going on in the tank. Add an extra air stone or two
Keep the tank water as clean as you can, and the water chemistry as stable and similar as you can to the wild conditions of the fish's habitat
Be prepared to medicate your fish if you have to. If you have any question regarding medicating the fish, just ask on the forum for help.
Do NOT feed them the day of their arrival. They have been in a plastic bag traveling from Africa for close to 24 hours. They will be stressed, and will not be interested in eating. Plus the last thing they need to do is to waste energy on digesting food instead of recovering from stress. Do not try to feed the first couple days, and don't bother with pellet food. Try frozen food or flake food at first. Remove any uneaten food to avoid polluting the tank water.

[Afrabat]

Great info guys!

[buntbarsch]

The only WC fish I actually bought from an importer are Tropheus and so far I haven't lost one yet.
When bringing them home, I set them up in a well established tank and add 5 to 6 good table spoons of a good aquarium grate marine salt. Lake Tanganyika is very rich on minerals and the marine sea salt will provide this. I have then reduced the amount with every weekly water change to a point were no salt was needed any longer.

[Aquamojo]

I have a couple dozen. Other than the initial quarantine period they are remarkably similar to F1 and later. I do notice that the spawn size and frequency are dramatically larger and more often. IMHO I thin the color and size is also more prenounced in F0 generations.

[Larry Johnson]

As some of you know I have been bringing fish in direct from the Stuart Grant operation in Malawi for about 5 years now.
Simply-
Keep the lights dimmed for a couple days,except while feeding (about an hour)
Keep on hand a medication for parasites (Clout) and baterial/ fungus infections (ECO rx Fungus control)
Keep the tank floor and water clean (20% water change every two days) for the first week.
Skip feeding the first day,but if the fish are feeding good after this, feed them twice lightly on the second day. Some fish will arrive skinny and they need to regain the lost weight.You may have to walk away from the tank while they eat,as they may be shy to move around and eat other wise. Wild fish are used to feeding all day long so feeding twice lightly will work better than one large feeding.
Initially I feed a medicated anti-parasite food for the first 3 days. This is in pellet form and I soak it for 20 minutes to soften it before squishing the air out in my hand. New fish do not seem to want to eat from the surface!
After two or three days of this I move them onto the main staple of my fish room.

Any fish arriving in rough shape needs to be treated with the Anti-bacterial right away, or risk losing the whole group.
Be Pro-active not re-active!

Cheers,Larry

[Sonny Disposition]

I haven't noticed a great deal of difference in caring for wild caughts as compared to domestics. They tend to be a little freaked out at first and to startle at your approach, and when the lights come on.

I usually give the wild caughts a tank of their own, both as a quarantine, and to give them a chance to get used to captivity.

In the mornings, I'll turn a dim room light on for a half hour or so to simulate sunrise. Next, I'll turn on other lights over other tanks in the rack, before finally turning on the light on the new arrivals.

My wild caught cichlids have all come from South Florida--salvini, urophthalmus, jaguars, and Hemichromis letourneauxi. They were all quick to adapt, and didn't need any special treatment before they would accept food. As you would expect, the salvini and jewels remained fairly shy without dithers--just like their captive born counterparts.

Only the sunfish I kept had difficulty figuring out that prepared food was something they could eat. If you put a fish in their tank that's already accepting prepared food, then they figure it out right away when they see the other fish eat.

Parasites have not been a problem. I quarantine all new arrivals for about a month, whether wild caught or not. I've had less trouble with wild caughts than with fish from a store. Every so often a fish will have a parasitic worm of some kind attached to its side. I'll wait until the worm grows a little, and then pull it off with forceps.

[ValleyAquatics]

I see some very good advice here. It's always good to hear from guys like Klaus and Larry.....guys who've been doing this a long time and I respect what they say.

When my new fish come in, I acclimate the bags to the tank water for 30 mins.
From there I net most fish from the bags to the tank.....do not put bag water in your tank.
For some of the fragile fish I might put some of the tank water in the bag to reduce some of the ph difference. The ph in the bag is going to drop from what it is at the lake or in dar.

I don't like the drip method as I think the sooner they get in the tank with clean water and lots of oxygenn is a lot better for them.

Once fish are in the tank I turn all lights off in the room and no tank lights. They need to rest and good to sleep. Next day I check on them and with room light on. If I see any dead I pull them. I then turn all lights off and leave them for the day.
I don't feed my imports for 2 days....on the 2nd day they get a light feeding. I usually have a small amount of sand on the bottom of the tank for them to sift through and try to pull organisms out from. With tropheus the sand is an indicator for me that they are healthy. If the sand has pits in it thats means the trophs are going through it looking for food. Always a good sign for me.

I agree with Klaus that some salt is good for them. Don't use epsom though to begin with. Epsom cleans them out and for fish that already haven't eaten for at least 3-5 days I think certain meds and epsom burns there insides up.

As far as eating, these fish can go a long time without food. Females as you know go 20-30 days without food depending on the species. Feeding them lightly is key as they stomachs aren't used to large amounts of food at 1 time.
I think mysis, or freeze dried krill is a good food to have on hand if the fish are finicky eaters, but don't over do it. Your goal is for them to eat flake or pellet food.

I normally only medicate if I see a problem which is rare and when I do I medicate very lightly. I always keep meds on hand but prefer to not use them if I don't have to.


As already stated water quality is the most important thing to have and I also agree with Ed that aeration is important also.

I learned alot my quarantine techniques from Julie(Frybabies) Brian Scott(Cichlidgeek) and Steve Perryman. All 3 were very good friends to me in the beginging and have continued to be very good friends with good advice.


The best advice I can give i think is don't be anxious and try doing to much. Sometimes it can cause more problems then help.
When I used to get new fish in I always wanted to be in the fish room with them and watch them but being in the room with lights on and walking around and putting your face to the tank can stress them so for the first few days I just like to check on them and then leave them alone.

[Longstocking]

Ok, first off I have never directly imported fish. So take what I have to say with a grain of salt. I have however kept many wild fish over the years. Everything from Xeno's, Cyps, to Petrochromis and Trophs etc....

There are two methods of thought that I have talked to my friends about.

One thing that most people tend to do.... is match the temp then net and dump into the tank. The drip method, since I am dealing with high ph fish can cause many problems and deaths!

One thing I have noticed is if they seem slugish after a couple of days you most likely have a problem. Then you have to figure out what it is. With imports I have noticed that parasites are the most common problems.

1) Julie (frybabies).... my close friend says she waits till there is a problem. Generally, salt can help with many problems. Some parasites, heavey breathing... etc can be helped with salt.

2) This method I am less familiar.... I have talked to many people about this but never in great detail. Some direct importers use basic (not too harmful.... example, they don't use clout ) meds right off the bat. I do know prazipro is a commonly used med that isn't too hard on the fish. Some also de-worm. I am not sure what the exact med is they use though. Can someone recommend a good de-worming med? I have always wondered this :coz: Some people use metro straight off the bat as well.

One common thing is... not feeding for 2 or 3 days. Lights off as well. Most fish are not use to bright light... no reason to stress them out any more than they already are.

Like Steve said... substrate will help as well. They are not use to being in a glass box, substrate will ease the stess as well.

Something I usually do, especially with wild caught Petros and Trophs is feed them food with garlic in it. This will help with parasites as well.

OK that is my 2 cents. Please take it with a grain of salt. There are many people with much more experience than me.

[Heyguy74]

This should be made a stick. Some great info here.

[CoryJEB]

A lot of great ideas on these post, not sure that I could say anything more, but I'll throw my 2 cents in too. Observation I'd have to say is one of the most valuable tools that you have when you acquire anything new. The actions and condition of the animal can point you to the course of action if necessary. I always quarantine new arrivals for 2 to 3 weeks, regardless of where I get them; shops, imports, wild caught, auctions & even from fellow hobbyist. A big pet peeve of mine is folks who put livestock in an auction and don't include their name or contact information. If I don't know who I'm buying from, I DON'T BUY IT!!!! Usually if I have to treat for something, Metronidasole, salt and/or higher temps will often be all that is need, of course, along with good, stable water conditions.

Eric

[fischfan13]

I would like to thank those who have stepped forward and contributed.

CoryJEB is Eric Bodrock
alloddballaquatics.com
I met Eric for the first time last Fall at an ACLC Meeting. His talk on breeding Oddballs is one of my favorite talks. Eric has been extremely successful keeping and breeding Lamprichthys tanganicanus .

On Eric's website he mentions Bob Bock. Bob is Sonny Disposition.
Bob and I hit it off right from the start because he was born and raised in Hudson County, NJ. Bob is also the past president of the North American Native Fishes Association, www.nanfa.org.

Larry Johnson, as many of you already know, has been making yearly trips to Lake Malawi for several years now.
This is Larry's homepage:
http://home.cogeco.ca/~ductapediver/larry%27s%20web%20page.htm

Aquamojo is Mo Devlin.
Mo's homepage is Aquamojo.com, and he has been gracing fish forums for years with his incredible pictures of all of his fish...Cichlids and non-Cichlids.
Mo is also the President of the ACA.

buntbarsch is Klaus Steinhaus.
Klaus' homepage is:
buntbarsch.ca
His photos of his Tangs are all over the internet and he helps lead the cause for C.A.R.E.S

I would like to thank each one of these gentleman who have been great contributors to the fish hobby.

[Mscichlid]

This a great post. Thanks a lot for your valued information. Gonna have to bookmark this one.

Francine

[barbour77]

Thanx everyone for the amazing insight there. Reading all of this makes me feel much better about taking my first shot at setting up a tank for wild-caughts.

[CrabbyMatty]

This a great post. Thanks a lot for your valued information. Gonna have to bookmark this one.

Francine

Thanx everyone for the amazing insight there. Reading all of this makes me feel much better about taking my first shot at setting up a tank for wild-caughts.

This has indeed been a very informative thread with input from some very experienced fish keepers. It's very rewarding to read that hobbyists like yourselves have learned and intend to apply some of these learnings to your own personal fish keeping. Please keep the rest of us informed and let us know about your experiences so that we can keep the teachings going. Thanks!

[fischfan13]

Ok, so it's one day before the African Shipment.
Good luck to everyone.

[QuarterMiler]

This is great info, so thanks to all who contributed. It will help me tremendously with some new WCs coming from Atlantis soon.

[barbour77]

What would people reccomend as a tank size for my group? I am getting a group of 12 cyno. sp. sanga from Atlantis and was wondering what type I should go with. I currently have a 55, 20, or a 40 breeder open. What to do?

[fishfreak69]

There are 2 different "types" of wild fish: fish that are "fresh" from the lake coming direct to you, and wild fish that have been imported by a company then come to you...

Fresh from the Lake:
In my experience I would make sure you have done a 20-40% water change 1-2 days prior the arrival of your new family members. I would not feed them for 2 days. I would, as I do with my fish, start them on Formalin for 2-4 treatments (every other day) with an aerator in the tank/vat. Remember that formalin will decrease the oxygenation of the water so surface agitation is key to promoting oxygen exchange at the surface of the water. After this is completed, I would put carbon in the tank for 2-3 days. During this I would feed metronidazole flake to knock out any type of internal/intestinal infestations for 7-10 days minimum. It is key to feed this food for AT LEAST this amount of time (sometimes I feed for 2 weeks) b/c it takes at the bare minimum 3-4 days for the medication to build up to become therapeutic for the fish. After the carbon has been in the water for 2-3 days I would check to see if there were any ulcerations, torn fins, any type of septicemia in the fish; if there is I would use a combination of pimafix and melafix for 4-5 days (again surface agitation is recommended b/c this medication also decreases oxygenation in water). This stuff works like a champ and usually heals wounds very quickly ~2-3 days or so. It is important that if you notice torn fins or blood streaks that you treat b/c that could be the early signs of a bacterial infection that could lead to septicemia. After the original treatment of metronidazole flake has been accomplished, I then start them on Romet flake to "jump" start their intestines to get used to the change in diet. If the fish are not eating what you want to give them, use fry from other fish to jump start their diets. They should begin eating immediately whatever you offer them. I use my own homemade feed as well as NLS, HBH flake, HBH Spirulina, Krill, and nelson silver cup feed in various sizes.

Stuff from Farms/other importers:
When I order from the farms or other importers I change it up a bit as they have or should have already been treated. I usually skip the formalin treatment and just use clout the 2nd day on arrival for 3 doses; I usually increase the dosage by 25% each time (1 tab = 10 gallons; for a 180g tank I would use 18, 20, 22 tablets). Then I go through the same steps as before. Remember, any signs of stress throughout any type of medication regimen you need to do a 20-30% water change and add carbon. Do not do a water change any heavier than this b/c you should have already changed the water upon arrival.

There are other treatments I use also; copper, oxylinic acid, praziquantril for other infestations. Praziquantril is basically a de-wormer so if you see any type of worms in the feces or on the side of the fish (anchor worms) this is the medication that will work wonders!!

Everyone has their own way of doing things as my recommendation would be to find one that works best for you and stick to it, however, be ready for the next step before any other secondary complications arise...

[fishfreak69]

There are 2 different "types" of wild fish: fish that are "fresh" from the lake coming direct to you, and wild fish that have been imported by a company then come to you...

Fresh from the Lake:
In my experience I would make sure you have done a 20-40% water change 1-2 days prior the arrival of your new family members. I would not feed them for 2 days. I would, as I do with my fish, start them on Formalin for 2-4 treatments (every other day) with an aerator in the tank/vat. Remember that formalin will decrease the oxygenation of the water so surface agitation is key to promoting oxygen exchange at the surface of the water. After this is completed, I would put carbon in the tank for 2-3 days. During this I would feed metronidazole flake to knock out any type of internal/intestinal infestations for 7-10 days minimum. It is key to feed this food for AT LEAST this amount of time (sometimes I feed for 2 weeks) b/c it takes at the bare minimum 3-4 days for the medication to build up to become therapeutic for the fish. After the carbon has been in the water for 2-3 days I would check to see if there were any ulcerations, torn fins, any type of septicemia in the fish; if there is I would use a combination of pimafix and melafix for 4-5 days (again surface agitation is recommended b/c this medication also decreases oxygenation in water). This stuff works like a champ and usually heals wounds very quickly ~2-3 days or so. It is important that if you notice torn fins or blood streaks that you treat b/c that could be the early signs of a bacterial infection that could lead to septicemia. After the original treatment of metronidazole flake has been accomplished, I then start them on Romet flake to "jump" start their intestines to get used to the change in diet. If the fish are not eating what you want to give them, use fry from other fish to jump start their diets. They should begin eating immediately whatever you offer them. I use my own homemade feed as well as NLS, HBH flake, HBH Spirulina, Krill, and nelson silver cup feed in various sizes.

Stuff from Farms/other importers:
When I order from the farms or other importers I change it up a bit as they have or should have already been treated. I usually skip the formalin treatment and just use clout the 2nd day on arrival for 3 doses; I usually increase the dosage by 25% each time (1 tab = 10 gallons; for a 180g tank I would use 18, 20, 22 tablets). Then I go through the same steps as before. Remember, any signs of stress throughout any type of medication regimen you need to do a 20-30% water change and add carbon. Do not do a water change any heavier than this b/c you should have already changed the water upon arrival.

There are other treatments I use also; copper, oxylinic acid, praziquantril for other infestations. Praziquantril is basically a de-wormer so if you see any type of worms in the feces or on the side of the fish (anchor worms) this is the medication that will work wonders!!

Everyone has their own way of doing things as my recommendation would be to find one that works best for you and stick to it, however, be ready for the next step before any other secondary complications arise...

granite, this is for Lake Malawi stuff only as I have not personally received any type of wild Tanganyikan fish... Tangs are much more sensitive to different medications, as, my regimen would not be appropriate for these delicate fish....